On Wednesday there were two fires southeast of Hot Springs, South Dakota along Oral Road east of the Hot Springs International Municipal Airport (map). They were approximately a couple of acres each, were about a mile apart, and they appeared to have started near the road. Firefighters were investigating the possibility that they were ignited accidentally by a passing vehicle, perhaps one that was pulling a trailer with overheated wheel bearings.
After working full time in wildland fire for 33 years, he continues to learn, and strives to be a Student of Fire.
View all posts by Bill Gabbert
11 thoughts on “Two fires south of Hot Springs, SD”
There have been numerous burnover events, runovers and fatalities over the past 20 years involving firefighters on the ground or riding in exposed positions with engines. Grab a look at the old CDF “Kelly York” video, or the Texas Forest Service “Attack from the Black” DVD that was made in 2007. In 2011, Texas had a volunteer firerfighter killed when he was run over by his own engine while fighting a smokey grassfire. It’s documented in a NIOSH report that was issued in 2012. Riding on the outside of an engine while trying to catch a rapidly moving fire is dangerous at best, and can get you dead! If you’ve got grass fires, how about a minor adaptation to put a spray bar on the bumpers like our County water trucks have for watering roads. Everyone is inside and safer, no fall-offs, runovers or burnovers.
0
0
Here in my part of the great plains, many progressive FD’s have done just that. Ranging from home-made spray bars and bumper sweeps to commercial, remote-controlled front nozzles similar to an ARFF truck only smaller. Many departments that used to insist that a guy on the outside was “the only way to stop these fires in our situation” now prohibit all outside riding, and surprise! The fires still go out! In fact, many of these FD’s are more efficient now, as the operator is out of the smoke and heat and can see. Plus, One firefighter can do the work of two, as the driver can set the nozzle and drive the line, without a second person needed. The second firefighter can staff a second truck to run in tandem, and do twice the work. I started on the front bumper almost 3 decades ago, whined with the rest when they made us stop, but would never to back. There IS a better way!
0
0
Back in the day (1971) we used to do mobile attack walking or running in front of the engine. One night, I was running at what felt like 20 mph trying to keep out from under the wheels of the engine. Didn’t have much time to aim the water at the fire though. After a bit, the engineer stopped momentarily for both of us firefighters (CDF type 1 brush trucks had two reel lines) to get on the back and resume mobile attack at a faster rate. We did catch the fire that night. I don’t know what current CalFire policy is on mobile attack, I suspect they do things much safer now.
0
0
As a volunteer firefighter in South Dakota, riding on an engine can be dangerous, but it gets the job done and we are safe about it. Think about it like this, have you ever tried to walk along a grass fire with 60 mph winds.
0
0
Stuart, I am a volunteer from montana. The state gives us type five and type six engines for use to use for free as long as we initial attack on state land as well. The DNRC told us they would take them away if we kept riding on them insteat of in them. The state had to pay out on a couple of accidents. We prefer to walk but during a wind event like you mentioned we ride in the cab. Some in the dept dont like riding the cab and we did not think it would work but it does. It works for us and is much safer than riding on the tank or fender. I have seen some pretty neat roll cages for firefighters to ride in all straped in and such. However, we have all been on the flank of a wind driven fire and had the wind switch, sometimes an engine even has to drive through the flames to get into the black in such a situation. Being straped into an enclosed cage a firefighter might take a lot of flame and smoke, one deep breath and it would be all over. If you are in the cab already you are good to go, I would not want to have to unstrap and unlock the cage in such an event. We decided riding on the engine is just too dangerous and potentially costly. I am not trying to start a fight because we used to do the same as your dept. but I would suggest you try riding in the cab. Ya might like it!
I also will apologize to the moderator as this post is in reaction to the pictures rather than the story itself.
0
0
In the cab or on the ground are the safest places to be. I have never been convinced otherwise. This position has made me unpopular at my dept. Mr. Gabbert, are fires in the first week of march unusual for South Dakota?
0
0
Zero: it is common to have wildfires and to conduct prescribed fires in March and April in many areas east of the Rocky Mountains. As the weather warms, the herbaceous vegetation that was killed by last fall’s frost again becomes an available fuel. Fire activity slows after green-up, which can occur in early May, depending on the location. Some areas east of the Rockies have increased fire activity again beginning in mid-summer, late-summer, or in the case of predominantly deciduous tree areas in the autumn after a hard freeze and after the leaves fall, adding ground fuel and allowing more sunlight to reach the ground.
0
0
Riding on the engine…. great way to kill yourself. Why do they continue to do this? Is it too hard to get on your own two feet and walk?
0
0
have you ever fought fire in south dakota its all open grass land most of the time the fires are moving pritty damn fast but i guess you can get off the truck and fight fire if you can run 20 mph
0
0
Brown Guy: South Dakota is not ALL open grass land, as shown in this picture of a fire in the Black Hills earlier this week. Oh, and I’d like to shoot some video of someone fighting fire at 20 mph. I’ve never seen that; it would be very instructive.
0
0
come on down if its another bad season like last year we could use all the help we can get
There have been numerous burnover events, runovers and fatalities over the past 20 years involving firefighters on the ground or riding in exposed positions with engines. Grab a look at the old CDF “Kelly York” video, or the Texas Forest Service “Attack from the Black” DVD that was made in 2007. In 2011, Texas had a volunteer firerfighter killed when he was run over by his own engine while fighting a smokey grassfire. It’s documented in a NIOSH report that was issued in 2012. Riding on the outside of an engine while trying to catch a rapidly moving fire is dangerous at best, and can get you dead! If you’ve got grass fires, how about a minor adaptation to put a spray bar on the bumpers like our County water trucks have for watering roads. Everyone is inside and safer, no fall-offs, runovers or burnovers.
Here in my part of the great plains, many progressive FD’s have done just that. Ranging from home-made spray bars and bumper sweeps to commercial, remote-controlled front nozzles similar to an ARFF truck only smaller. Many departments that used to insist that a guy on the outside was “the only way to stop these fires in our situation” now prohibit all outside riding, and surprise! The fires still go out! In fact, many of these FD’s are more efficient now, as the operator is out of the smoke and heat and can see. Plus, One firefighter can do the work of two, as the driver can set the nozzle and drive the line, without a second person needed. The second firefighter can staff a second truck to run in tandem, and do twice the work. I started on the front bumper almost 3 decades ago, whined with the rest when they made us stop, but would never to back. There IS a better way!
Back in the day (1971) we used to do mobile attack walking or running in front of the engine. One night, I was running at what felt like 20 mph trying to keep out from under the wheels of the engine. Didn’t have much time to aim the water at the fire though. After a bit, the engineer stopped momentarily for both of us firefighters (CDF type 1 brush trucks had two reel lines) to get on the back and resume mobile attack at a faster rate. We did catch the fire that night. I don’t know what current CalFire policy is on mobile attack, I suspect they do things much safer now.
As a volunteer firefighter in South Dakota, riding on an engine can be dangerous, but it gets the job done and we are safe about it. Think about it like this, have you ever tried to walk along a grass fire with 60 mph winds.
Stuart, I am a volunteer from montana. The state gives us type five and type six engines for use to use for free as long as we initial attack on state land as well. The DNRC told us they would take them away if we kept riding on them insteat of in them. The state had to pay out on a couple of accidents. We prefer to walk but during a wind event like you mentioned we ride in the cab. Some in the dept dont like riding the cab and we did not think it would work but it does. It works for us and is much safer than riding on the tank or fender. I have seen some pretty neat roll cages for firefighters to ride in all straped in and such. However, we have all been on the flank of a wind driven fire and had the wind switch, sometimes an engine even has to drive through the flames to get into the black in such a situation. Being straped into an enclosed cage a firefighter might take a lot of flame and smoke, one deep breath and it would be all over. If you are in the cab already you are good to go, I would not want to have to unstrap and unlock the cage in such an event. We decided riding on the engine is just too dangerous and potentially costly. I am not trying to start a fight because we used to do the same as your dept. but I would suggest you try riding in the cab. Ya might like it!
I also will apologize to the moderator as this post is in reaction to the pictures rather than the story itself.
In the cab or on the ground are the safest places to be. I have never been convinced otherwise. This position has made me unpopular at my dept. Mr. Gabbert, are fires in the first week of march unusual for South Dakota?
Zero: it is common to have wildfires and to conduct prescribed fires in March and April in many areas east of the Rocky Mountains. As the weather warms, the herbaceous vegetation that was killed by last fall’s frost again becomes an available fuel. Fire activity slows after green-up, which can occur in early May, depending on the location. Some areas east of the Rockies have increased fire activity again beginning in mid-summer, late-summer, or in the case of predominantly deciduous tree areas in the autumn after a hard freeze and after the leaves fall, adding ground fuel and allowing more sunlight to reach the ground.
Riding on the engine…. great way to kill yourself. Why do they continue to do this? Is it too hard to get on your own two feet and walk?
have you ever fought fire in south dakota its all open grass land most of the time the fires are moving pritty damn fast but i guess you can get off the truck and fight fire if you can run 20 mph
Brown Guy: South Dakota is not ALL open grass land, as shown in this picture of a fire in the Black Hills earlier this week. Oh, and I’d like to shoot some video of someone fighting fire at 20 mph. I’ve never seen that; it would be very instructive.
come on down if its another bad season like last year we could use all the help we can get